3. *'War of the White Dragon' -Defender Meeting*

*'War of the White Dragon' -Defender Meeting*


  • sighs with Jerr's words offering blessings of True Sight to those whom ask for it… though she no doubtedly will drain her savings with this decision.... We kin weed em out though they'll just stick another mage in its place it would seem. Though if we stick to this course just prior to making a decisive move it migh' prove beneficial..


  • Looks up suddenly and around the room.

    "damn, I hate it when a good idea works both ways. Anybody know how to tell if the local beasties are all real? The other side has been fairly accurate at guessing our actions but maybe that is because we are ignoring the possibility they could be chirping on a nearby branch and listening to us get set."

    He shakes his head and looks over to Keira. "Nice summation as usual . . . although I do not agree with everything she has said. And yes, I have fought in Dragon form, against another dragon once, but I would not give good odds to be able to take Sharn. Intimidate a bunch of Orcs? Maybe.

    "Lyte, your defence plan looks good but we still face the problem of a wide front that we cannot adequately man against a concerted push in a single place unless we know in advance where that push will be. And that is the crux of it. I think they are managing to see us and we are still blind in regards to them. Abners death just hammered that home. I am not laying blame, not complaining, just trying to see how we can learn more . . . work with more. If we keep fighting this war defensively I do not like what is going to happen. And I do not want to make my home in Peltarch, no offence to the brave folk from there who are helping us in our hour of need."

    Jerr looks about to say something else but shuts his mouth and sits down with a thoughtful look on his face.

  • N

    Ad rises from his seat and waits till all eyes turn to him

    I've asked the druids to speak to any vermin in the region of Norwick. They will surely know of any food stores and will avoid large concentrations of occupants, that we might learn where the enemy congregates, I've also asked specifically to try to find any hammerings that we determine their workshops.
    Even if we only find where is dangerous for the vermin we'll at least know what areas the enemy is trying to protect from prying eyes…grins and that's where we want to try to pry by other means.
    Hopefully this can be achieved quickly and they'll relay the results.

    with a nod , he sits


  • Keira waits for a lull in the scouting-related conversation before speaking up
    _'We're outnumbered, but they're people. They have things they care for, things they need. We can strike at those. By choosing what to fight, and when, we can make a local advantage, in our favour and leave before they respond. Even if our people fail to get out, the success of the right mission will outweigh our losses.

    The dragon.
    Pulling our best and most capable troops and commanders away to strike at Sharn is a very large risk. It shouldn't be our first resort. What would be required to buy, or make scrolls of shapechange? If any here are used to fighting in a dragon's form - that would be a more elegant way to fight Sharn. Even if we can only muster an illusion of a dragon on our side, we could damage the alliances with our perceived strength.

    The Giants
    They have faith, homes, young. Any attacks on their homes will reduce reinforcements, maybe encourage them to bring stronger warriors, or the priests that can raise their fallen, home. They will have a Temple. They will have children. They will have homes that they care for, and hope to return to. We can take that from them, as they took Norwick.

    The Alliances
    They must meet to discuss strategy. This happens in a neutral area, or in one of the main camps. If it's in the main camp, at least some of the commanders must travel to get there. They believe they're safest in the heart of their lines, this does make them more vulnerable than at the lines. Need scouting information about these meetings, where they occur, travel routes. We should send trappers, to lay ambushes. Make them fear to walk in their own camp, or between them.

    Troops
    Spread disease, poison. Destroy their supplies. If their priests are casting cure disease, they're not casting other cures or raises or blessings or protections. Send in halforcs in captured peon armor. In an army of more than a thousand, they won't know all the faces or voices. A soldier from the other side of the camp trying to scrounge different food is common in a war camp.

    Commanders
    Identify their commanders. Some are worse than others. Some have been promoted for reasons other than tactical brilliance. Keep them alive. Kill the competent ones. success will hurt morale, make the weight of their numbers less effective. Again, the benefit of their significant loss will outweigh the loss of our agent. To save Jiyyd, to save Norwick, there will still be volunteers.

    They're watching us. These tactics are as valid for them, as they are for us. If you only have three launcher carts - build decoys, staff them, don't let more than a few know which are real. They could be sending halforcs, or others, to us as mercenaries._


  • …at the mention of Wolf's name, Dwin frowns a bit and shakes his head sadly.

    Those numbers seem too low anyway. Don't they?


  • Easier to get a wizard or a druid to fly high over the town. Wolf has done this already, giving us the numbers of the enemy (100 bugbears, 300 goblins, a few giants) and noting that the south gate is guarded by many goblins and they are working on fortifying it. We should fly over again before we conduct any assault so we can see enemy positions.


  • Ginger looks over the map

    Can we get into Spellweaver Keep from the pass? Can a Spellweaver mage get into the Keep from the Emerald Tower? I know the top of Spellweaver Tower offers a dragon's eye view of Norwick. I'd like to get a peek at what the bugbears have done to the town - where there weak points are - before we go making solid plans on how to take it back. I guess I'm suggesting a bit of scouting out their defenses.

  • G

    Lyte speaks firmly

    _"The enemy are the bugbears, goblins, orcs and giants, led by the dragon…not any of us gathered here.

    This foe is strong, and they have kicked all of our asses around, lets not bicker, and lets try and pull together...otherwise we might as well hand them all the lands on a platter, aye?

    Dwin is 100% right about Sam's Hill being the strongest defensive spot in the region. It offers great visibility, the ground the enemy approaches from is relatively flat and has little cover, and it is flanked on one side by the wolves camp, and by our western defenses on the other.

    Losing Norwick as we have, we really couldnt ask for better ground to make a stand, and stand there we will.

    The weaknesses present to the defense of the Hill are to the west, above the wolves' camp. Those high cliffs wrap around, and are a threat.

    Somehow those need blocked off, or a huge gap dug out, to prevent the enemy from flanking Dwin on his west. The Wolve's Den itself needs to be included inside the defensive perimeter, aye?

    The other cliff, between our two forces, that run towards Norwick also need a trench dug to keep the enemy the blazes off it. The access up there should be eliminated, and obviously, a gate or other obstacle should hold the access point at Dwin's center.

    If Dwin thinks it would be useful, I propose a gate between our two forces, on the cliff we share. It would open on Dwin's left, and our right, and allow us faster aid to one another. See my little crude little sketch I made out there yesterday.

    http://www.pixhost.com/pixd/dukstuf/norwick1.jpg

    I'm sure Dwin is already on top of this, with similar ideas, and I just wanted to present my thoughts on the matter.

    As far as the cliffs out between the Temple and the Keep go, if we are going to try and take Norwick back, it is my opinion we should do it in steps, as we did with the Orc fortress. Instead of thinking of "taking back the town", we need to think practically at the ground it sits on, and approach it in a military fashion, one conquerable piece of real estate at a time.

    That means taking what ground we can, holding it, until we move to take more. The cliffs overlooking Norwick's gates are the obvious first step, however, I dont have a good map to know how feasible this might be to hold once were on it, and of course, the enemy is too strong for a direct assault to take it without huge casualties that could prove fatal in a counterattack by the enemy.

    Other preliminary moves would need to happen first to cut off or weaken their response, and frankly, the enemy is very, very strong.

    I dont like to be pessimistic, but, unless we can come up with a really clever scheme, that doesnt involve invisibility, doesnt seperate our meagre forces so that they cant support one another, and somehow lessens the enemy's superior numbers available for fighting, I dont see this succeeding.

    The first thing we need, however, to really plan taking Norwick back, is a solid map, with a clear picture of what the enemy has done with the points of entry into the town, and the cliffs, and the condition of the walls, the gates, and so on.

    What say we get this first, then consider the possibilities."_


  • I think Lyte is referring to the cliffs overlooking the gates of Norwick, just north of Norwick and slightly south of the Keep and the temple.

    ((along the southern edge of the S Nars Pass map))


  • Dwin glares at the wiggler that all of a sudden is offering tactical defensive advice. He starts to say something, shakes his head, and sighs

    Not worth it. What do wigglers know of defenses and war anyway? These are the same folks that sent an old graybeard wiggler out as a scout recently… one of their best who is now worm-food... or worse...

    Holding that hill… that may be difficult, but I agree that launching an attack from that hill will be easier than it would be from Sam's Hill.

    I believe Sam's Hill is a stronger defense position, though. The Hill in the middle of the pass can be easily surrounded and then the seige will be on us...

    The attack needs to be swift. If holding that hill and using seige weapons from that location is part of the overall idea, then so be it. We should not have any disillusions, however, about being able to keep that hill for any duration of time.


  • ((Norwick had been focusing on improving its southern defenses for a while (forums posts that go a while back) and doing minimal amounts of improvements to Sam's Hill … the real focus on Sams hill didnt happen until AFTER the town was taken.

    I can respond IC if you want, but because none of the builds ever went in, I will assume that perhaps you werent aware that IG, Norwick's southern defenses had in fact been quite improved.))


  • Maybe the little effort that was put into fortifying Sam's Hill would have helped more if it were spent on the southern defenses instead. Regardless, that is past, we need to think about retaking the town now.

    Lyte's suggestion is that we take back Norwick more gradually, not dividing our forces with a feint and sneak attack, but starting just with the hill that divides Norwick from the southern Nars Pass. If we hold that hill, overlooking Norwick, we could mount a further assault on the forces occupying the town. This sounds like a sounder plan, to me, as it divides our forces less, and makes the elemental reinforcements that could be used to actually take the town more believable. If we can effectively hold that hill, I think this is the way to go.


  • Dwin snorts and looks at Alvah

    Norwick's full might?

    Norwick's "full might" was erroneously SPLIT between guarding our flanks and fighting on Jiyyd's walls.

    NOW, we have the full might of Norwick on the hill. We also have the full might of the Dwarven Hold. We have Peltarch's soldiers and archers from the camp.

    And you want to continue to run?

    Folks! we have a VERY limited window of opportunity here… We are already building the defenses that Lyte has mentioned... if we move now, we hand over more footholds to the enemy and leave Norwick further and further from our grasp!

    ((waiting for the dev/build at this point)).

  • Y

    Alvah nods and delivers a brief retort

    _"While I do know that Jiyyd is the breadbasket of Narfell, I would point out that the enemy would gain nothing by taking it if it were first destroyed as I suggested.

    In one regard, you are correct. There would be hungry, desparate people. Especially in my home, Peltarch. However, I would wager that this is largely unavoidable; how long do you suppose the farmers in Jiyyd will be able to continue processing crops while an army of orcs, giants, goblins, bugbears, and even a dragon besiege their very walls from three sides?

    I think that attempting to fortify Sam's hill with nothing but its present defenders would most likely be for naught. I would remind you that the full might of the Norwick militia was unable to stop the enemy you are proposing to block with a few portable barricades when they were fighting from behind Norwick's larger city walls.

    We are too few in number to attempt to cover a front as spread out as the one we are currently attempting to hold. Choosing a smaller out would improve our chances considerably."_

  • G

    Lyte nods, listening

    _"It seems obvious to me that losing both Norwick and Jiyyd means destruction for all towns and communitys within marching range of the enemy.

    Much of Peltarch's foodstuffs, and also ore and wood originate from it's south. Pirates and storms make shipping in raw materials expensive and unreliable.

    The more southern communitys that fall, the more homeless, desperate people will eat up the foodstuff left available from a shrinking supply.

    Each step we fall back increases the likelihood for a total enemy victory, with us losing resources, and the enemy gaining.

    For this reason, we are forced to hold Jiyyd and the crossroads as a new line….and this position could certainly be much, much worse.

    In effect, it is is one front, not two. It is a long front, yes, but it is easy for us to move troops along it's straightish, flat, roaded length...and much harder for the enemy to move troops from the roadless, forested,cliff broken fronts between the near plains, and the valley north of Norwick, which are the enemies two active fronts.

    Now, we absolutely need to baracade and wall Sam's Hill, yes we do. It has naturally excellant ground, which is fortunate.

    We should be able to interlock the hill with the cliff we already defend adjacent to it. Currently we have baracades there, but perhaps we could add a gate on the cliffs, between the two positions, for fast access to aid one another.

    Also, I suggest we move our existing artillery, catapults and the like, onto the strip of cliff between Sam's Hill and the western defenses, where the Gypsys have for long posted right between our forces.

    There, all of are artillery will be centrally located to strike both south east and southwest, defending either section by turning slightly.

    Our dragon weapons also should be set and camoflauged in this region, to support an attack on Sam's Hill or the Jiyyd defenses.

    Key right now is to get baracades, walled gates and such things up on the hill....and fast.

    We have sent the extra barracades we have over, and they are portable and sectional, and are simply pegged into the ground. I expect many are already firmly in place as we speak."_


  • Dwin furrows his brow.

    Havent ya seen the smoke comin from Norwick these last ten-days? Norwick IS burnt… Not much stands there from what I hear.

    As for the supplies they reap from Norwick, we had enough for a small town to last a ten-day or 2 at the most. I would assume those supplies have already been squandered and spolied by the invaders.

    Norwick is not a supply resource for them, but I do not doubt it is now a depot for their own supplies, soldiers and filth.

    The Rawlins is where they draw their supplies from.

  • Y

    Alvah waits for a suitably long lull in the conversation and hubbub caused by Grag's sudden appearance before slowly rising to his feet and speaking.

    _"First of all I would like to state that I hold no title other than Sentinel, and hold sway with no political organizations in any town or city. In fact, I command but a few loyal men.

    Furthermore I should say that understand the desire to not lose any further ground to these invaders.

    However, with due respect to those plans that have been presented here today, my conscience obligates me to point out the unfavorable position that current plans of attack would keep us in.

    Jiyyd's defensive wall was an incredible effort, however, there was one fatal flaw in its design; the designs, like most of us, did not forsee the fall of Norwick. However, a wise man knows that plans must be altered as situations change.

    The situation has changed.

    As it stands, those defenders that still live from the fall of Norwick have little chance of holding back the armies that they are now proposing to sally fourth and assault. If Norwick is no longer a barrier, there is nothing to keep them from marching right into Jiyyd behind their defensive line. That means that Jiyyd now fights a war with enemies on three fronts. The orcs in the central plains, the giants to the east, and the goblins and bugbears that will no doubt come from behind when it suits their purposes.

    With this army ready to march right around the Jiyyd wall, we are forced to acknowledge that the wall is no longer fulfilling its intended purpose. Thus, there is no reason to keep it.

    One way that has been suggested to deal with that problem is to attempt to hastily retake Norwick with a sneak attack. This -may- work. However, I would say that it is most likely not the best option. To get the number of warriors that such a plan would require defenders would have to be drawn from Jiyyd's battlements.

    As I recall, the enemy nearly overran those at the same time that it was taking Norwick. The enemy has the numbers necessary to make it safe for them to divide their forces. We do not.

    The report we heard earlier stated that the enemy is drawing most of its supplies from raids on Jiyyd, and from recently occupied Norwick.

    I say we take those supplies from them. Norwick is a wooden city. Burn it, and take away the enemy's supplies by doing so. Of course, if a single, united, stand was the chosen course of action, something similar would have to be done to Jiyyd. We would take what supplies that we can carry from it, and destroy the rest.so as to avoid it being used by our enemies. Once the people there are evacuated there will be no reason for us to make our stand in such horrendous conditions."_

    Alvah points up towards the large map that Lyte used in discussion of her strategy.

    _"The logical place to hold them is north of the crossroads. Further north than the Hobgoblin cave so as to avoid the possibility of a flanking assault. We could hold them there. The combined forces of Jiyyd, Norwick, the Camp, and Peltarch. There we would fight without our self imposed divisions impairing our ability to achieve victory. There we could fight as one.

    This would also allow us to group our artillery, and anti-dragon weaponry in such a way that would maximize its efficiency.

    And while it might not leave a sweet taste in our mouths, I do believe it is the option most likely to bring about victory."_

  • S
    Legion

    Walks in covered in snow and uncloaks himself*
    Freinds I have been honored to be visited by my old freind Argentius the gentle! HE gave me hope and showed me a way to git to Sharn! I shall be assembling a task force to git rid of this abstad we shall CUT OFF THE HEAD AND WATCH THE BODY ROTT!!! raises his arm in anger THose tha I willbe nedin I hope ye will musta up the courage for this dangerous but very importunt mission to stop this war onc ean fer all!
    scurries off to send letters to those needed


  • Lily opens the binder looking through it and following Lyte before answering

    "Number two under …'eatin' the Pan. If we 'ave folks tha' can successfully ruse the orc into believin' they 'ave a mage capable of summonin' constructs… Are we equally able ta place an orc ruse within their gates ta gather intel?"

    looking over the plans some more she continues...

    "Another alternative brought up by others as far as deversions go was mebbe using the same ruse yuh folks are talkin' 'bout 'ere ta trick something else into attackin' the Norwick gates. Mebbe trolls... We 'ave enough maglin's wanderin' 'bout as em day in day out... mebbe one a em could trick their ranks into fightin' against the orcs. Wether it be with words... or one a their brethern fallen to a claimed bugbear beserker…"

    shrugs tossing out some questions and ideas as she continues to flip through the binder...


  • I have discussed a plan with Dwin to take Norwick from the east, the south, or both. Combining his plan with the invasion by the Featherflights will make it much more effective. I think that plan is a bit more fleshed out, sounds a bit more manageable, and should be used in lieu of "heating the pan".

    I would add one more element to our overall plans, which is that we should try to intercept enemy messengers with our own sneaks positioned at certain strategic chokepoints, especially in the underdark. It is actually not difficult to travel quietly and safely through the underdark, if we're lucky, if we hold the chokepoints against runners, and keep our force as far east of the lake as possible, moving quickly.

    The elemental force cannot be summoned quickly, it will take days to build it up. It will have to be raised either around Oscura and brought through the underdark; in Saurial lands; or someplace else–perhaps the Featherflight lands, if they'll allow it. That's something that needs to be looked into seriously.

    I doubt we can stop them from getting resources in the Rawlins. It's just too big and too spread out. Also, the goblins and orcs apparently aren't trading much with each other. I would rather move into Norwick quickly and hold the gates before they can muster reinforcements than hitting them anywhere in the Rawlins and thus alerting them to our attack before we secure the towns.