Outpost in the rawlinswood
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Building the tower of solid steel is…foolish. That will take a long time to build. On top of that, goblins could attack it before it's even done being built, thus rendering this entire plan moot.
Look, I respect what you want. Hells, keeping the goblins at bay is something we all want. But you're going about it the wrong way.
Goblins are mobile, this fortress is not. Drive them out of one hole, they will find another. So the need for another tower will arise.
You will build another tower, and another, and another, until you don't have enough men to defend them all and the town. And then the goblins will strike, while your guard is spread thin.
Now, you talk about building it below the treeline, rather than above it. Will this work? No, it won't. Before, you'd have been trying to look through the canopy for the goblins. Now, you'll just be looking through the trunks of the trees. You've already said you don't plan on damaging the forest here, so how do you plan to go about this? Will you cut down a section of the forest? Then you will have druids on the warpath towards your town, and the goblins will have an even better idea of what area to avoid. Will you stare really hard, and hope to see through the trees? We all know that won't happen.
I've said it before and I'll say it again. An auxiliary unit of scouts in the Norwick militia would be much more effective in this regard. They know what to look for, they can move with the goblins, without the need for costly, time-consuming, resource-consuming, gold-consuming construction. They will avoid these disputes with the druids by not damaging the woods as this tower, regardless of the care that Cyrian and the Gondar take, inevitably will. Concerns on their ability to warn the town as quickly as possible? None necessary, simply equip them with arrows which, when fired or upon the speaking of a command word, are enchanted to light up. A simple enchantment that most any mage in the land could create for half the cost of the construction of fireworks or a system to launch flares. Or if that's not to your liking, then arrows with holes drilled in them to make the wind create a whistling sound, and enchanted with a spell to make that sound into a near-deafening roar? Again, a simple enchantment, very cost-effective.
Hells, I'd even be willing to help in their recruitment and training of such a unit if need be, without compensation, just because I believe this strongly in it. Imagine that? A druid working with the militia on something.
@b2081da5a8=Lucidious:
If the circle has anything constructive to offer, my door is always open.
Lucidious, I realize that your first priority is defending this town, and this exactly as it should be. That being said, the circle has offered constructive criticism based on what we see day after day, year after year…and, I might add, has done so repeatedly even before this tower's construction began, and was ignored every time. That the town chooses to ignore those who live in these woods, and the agreements they make with them, does not instill me with any sort of confidence for this endeavor.
I do not, under any circumstances, want to see this town harmed. Norwick and the circle have a long history of working together for a common good. Why allow the construction of a system of towers in this forest get in the way of that, especially when the suggestions made by myself and so many others in the circle would be even more effective, both logistically and financially?
To be blunt…I find the unwillingness to listen to the opinions of others to be most disconcerting. I pray it's not the start of conflict between this town and my family.
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Cyrian lets anyone interested know that he has decided that half the towers structure will be located underground, he believes that this will provide the tower immense stability such as that of a tree, also that the structure will in fact be made of solid steel.
After having much discussions with Dentin it was decided that the towers peak will not be above the tree canopy after all, instead the signals used to alert the town will be in the form of flares, and fireworks fired into the sky, causing enough noise to alert everyone in the area and near town, as well as providing a significant light show to alert the town watch.
With this in mind Cyrian lets it known that he will be needing large supplies of Steel.
Further discussions were about the entrance to the tower, Cyrian was hoping for it to be hidden and not actually visible from outside the tower, this way anyone who hopes to attack the tower directly will have no easy access to the inside without climbing the surface of the wall to get to the top.
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@38fd66b187=Clan:
I wonder what the local folks thought when Peltarch built their outpost south of the city?
"The bandits wont let it happen."
"They'll kill ya before its built."
Well, if they can build an outpost and maintain it all these years, by Moradin so can we!
<d>Peltarch got more folk teh get demselves killed on a hill. We are pretty sparse in deh numbers cousin.. Nae sound wise teh me. Just put yehself out der on a tower made of wood, sorrounded by a moat dat goin teh catch fire.
*Motions with his staff as he talks *
<d>All sorts of shite in deh woods around yeh. Gobbers, wigglers, greenskin archers, grenadiers, umbers, yuan ti. Anna yeh cen nae see em frumma yeh vantage point cus of deh foliage.
- Plants the staff in the ground *
<d>Unless yeh is plannin an archery contest fer deh critters dat live in deh woods, me think yeh been misled about dis tower. We nae Peltarch, we cen nae juss draft countless folk fer deh militia. Ne'er mind dey is goin teh hate yeh fer sendin em into dat death trap.
- Shakes his head as he makes his way towards Oscura leaning heavily on his staff *
<d>Nae wise. Nae wise at all.</d></d></d></d>
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she shrugs
Regardless, I'm not going to waste the abilities my goddess gives me on something that, on the one hand, won't last more than a tenday, and on the other, is being built in violation of agreements that have existed between the town and the circle for years.
I've said why I think this will be entirely ineffective, and what I think would be much more so, and if you don't want to listen to the input of someone who's in this forest nearly every day then the consequences will be your own to deal with.
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Uh.. Peltarch tower is like fortress. Cyrian want to build small wood one…. and farther from town than Peltarch's... Dwin...
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Mord puts in a quiet word to his commander after lseveral ong patrols to the west and surveying the lake just south of the gates With the Saurian pushing from the south what of a tower in the middle of the lake. It would provide warnin from the south and provide strong crossfire on attacks on the gate. Mayhap start with this and look further out as time comes. The construction and supply could be supposrted easily from town and skiff or a sunken causeway could provide acces to it.
I have too often seen what over extended supply lines can cause.
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I wonder what the local folks thought when Peltarch built their outpost south of the city?
"The bandits wont let it happen."
"They'll kill ya before its built."
Well, if they can build an outpost and maintain it all these years, by Moradin so can we!
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_Wolf shakes his head, sighing..
Is good you want to get goblins out, and is good you trying, but… this wont work.
Is being built in the middle of goblins, will be surprised if even get finished. They going to throw grenades, fireballs... trails off ...while you build it. And once it damaged, or destroyed, going to waste more resource to rebuild? Not best plan.
Druids can have birds watch the goblins, and see what they doing. Norwick can send scouts to see too. One tower not going to make goblins go away, just annoy them. And isnt just goblins in the woods..._
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after hearing Raisa, lucid seems rather disapointed
Cyrian has shown undeniable results in his efforts and I will continue to support him in any way I can.
If the circle has anything constructive to offer, my door is always open.
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Make sure deh tower have a few tombs in deh basement… Save us deh trouble of draggin deh dead back teh town.
- Foilir smiles and walks off leaning on his staff *
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Fill the tower with kegs behind the walls with a magic key word trigger. Wait for some big powerful goblin to take charge of the tower. Send a note in goblin to the goblin king. And BLAM! No more goblin king. Might discourage future take overs.
::shrugs::
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The goblins are going to do everything you just listed wether or not there is a tower anyway. . the difference is that with the tower it may change the focus of the attacks from the town to the tower, and of course we can monitor the goblins better from the tower, also once the tower is complete the goblin population of the forest will inevetibly begin to diminish.
I don't know about you, but I would rather defend the town from a location where the town and the citizens within cannot be harmed by the stray magic that destroys someones house, or by the stray foe that gets past the defences and begins to slaughter the people.
No matter what there will always be some way to destroy the tower, kill the guards, bypass its line of sight, take control of it etcetera. . but the same goes for anything, we can see proof of this by looking into history, as far back as the Lost City destroyed by its own peoples wreckless desire for power, the city of Peltarch, fallen apart by the corruption that grew within like a cancer, the Gypsy camp that was destroyed when the Gnolls gained access to powerful magics by their gods, no matter how well defended or how advanced any of those places were they still fell, if building a tower will decrease the chance of that happening to Norwick by even the slightest, then it will be worth it.
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After hearing of Fadia's conversation with Cyrian, Raisa is seen nodding agreement at parts.
"So long as the tower did what its proponents think it will, I would do all I could to help. But it seems the planning thus far has not taken into account the full capabilities of the goblins. As I told the Chancellor, better fortifying the town itself might be a more appropriate use of energy. Whenever I am present at an attack, I see the changes that have been made go unused and a disorganized and wasteful defense."
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She's got some good points there.
Cyrian, lets chat about this sometime soon. When we built the wall upon the southern cliff of town, i thought that might be a good spot for a tower. Maybe we should reconsider the location…
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Cyrian, you may need more than one druid to work on that cliff. Hardening a small patch of ground is one thing, but an entire cliff? I tried some large scale things like that when we reshaped the glenn, and let me tell you…it's exhausting.
Maybe you should come to a meeting of the circle? You're bound to at least get your voice heard by the more able ones in our family.
To be honest, though, it seems a bit of a crackpot idea to me. The goblins are bound to attack it first. When that happens, one of three things will follow:
1.) The tower will be destroyed, in some form or another, and the guards killed.
2.) The goblins will take over the watchtower and kill the guards manning it.
or 3.) A large number of militiamen will be called out to reinforce it. This being a small town, the militia has a finite amount of manpower, and any event such as that will leave your town vulnerable to attack from drow, goblins from the east, yuan-ti, or worse. Hells, we know that the greenskins have summoned at least one very powerful demon that nearly overtook the town when it had a full complement of guards, not to mention a few freelance adventurers manning the wall. What happens if one attacks while everyone's out reinforcing the garrison at the tower? Yes, healing it was a quick way to finish it off, but are we really going to ask powerful healers to stay behind when people could be dying out at the outpost?
On top of that, there are other disadvantages to a watchtower, however tall and regardless of the terrain it's built on. For one thing, goblins could simply learn its blind spots and work through them to launch surprise attacks on the town, catching all of you unawares. Remember that this is a forest. I love this forest and guard it with my life, but I can't deny that scouting inside it, especially from a stationary location above the treeline, is a nightmare. Add to that the fact that there is a threat of townsmen becoming too used to having the alarm there to warn them, and you can begin to see how things could get very bad, very fast.
Second, a tower is stationary. It can't retreat. It can't hide. That far out in goblin territory, that's a real disadvantage and something that must be considered. Third, even after all that, if you still decide to build it, it will take precious hours to get a band together to reinforce the tower should it come under attack. Like I said earlier, manpower is a finite resource in a town this size, and going to this tower is a high-risk venture. You may very well be sending your soldiers to their deaths.
If you want some sort of early warning system, it's my opinion that a tower would almost surely not be a wise choice. Perhaps employ some trackers? Certainly, there are many that are friendly with the circle and will respect it, thereby keeping us from butting heads with your town. And most of those also know these woods well and will know what to look for should goblins decide to attack. Also, unlike a large watchtower, these are able to hide, to fall back if need be, and many are capable of sending animal messengers to warn the town of impending attacks, without the need to potentially damage the forest.
Two or three small units of these trackers - perhaps as small as two people to each one - patrolling the west woods and equipped with some basic healing potions and issued decent-quality gear should be every bit as effective as a watchtower, and would certainly be nowhere near as invasive.
She shrugs But regardless of what I say, if you're determined to build it, you probably will. I would still, however, suggest attending a circle meeting and voicing your intentions. We may have some suggestions, and it would go a long way to making the people who live in the forest more open to your plan.
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- Foilir just looks at Fadia wandering about town talking of a druid outpost in its midst *
"Anna wut yeh call dat?"
- Points at Fadia with his staff *
"Yeh expectin a lass wit hairy legs anna twigs anna leaves in her hair?"
- Motions Cyrian over *
"Yeh want teh speak go speak… Yeh deh un proposin buildin in der yard, yer responsibility to talk teh her.."
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Cyrian quickly turns down the wall of fire idea as being too dangerous, unpredictable, and not environment friendly
I hear all this talk about how the druids are not going to be happy about this construction, and yet not a single druid has approached me to share their concerns, or ideas.
As for a permanent solution, this tower is only the beginning step for a permanent solution, it is much easier to monitor the goblins from an outpost in the deep woods then it is from behind the walls of Norwick, also this tower provides travellers a safe place to rest, once the tower is complete trade routes to the west may be established knowing that travel through the deep parts of the forest will be safe.
After the tower is completed I plan to look into removing the goblins from the hold and building a more permanent fortification within the cave system.
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Dentin, I agree with what yer sayin… I have been suggesting signal towers fer a while. I think that we should consider some north of town, as far as the hill as well. Anywhere threats could be comin from, we should have a way to know about em.
Maybe you and me should talk about such a system.
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- Foilir just leans on his staff *
"So let me ask yeh dis.. Wut yeh consider a greater threat? A few greenskins dat we cut down wit little effort or a bunch of farked off druids dat own dese woods?"
- Foilir flicks some sort of bug off his shoulder plate *
"If'n yeh is askin most of us folk who live eer anna weild an axe. Deh greenskin are no more den dat der bug me sent a'flyin. Nae too much to worry about, except fer farm animals anna a few wood gates dat need teh be replaced."
- Stops a moment and peers at the giant torch he is building in the middle of the old thick woods *
"Juss imagine if yeh bit of arsonist defense system go awry… Why me is nae goin teh deal with farked off Druids... Preventin folk frumma minin anna wood choppin, huntin er juss wanderin..
If dat happen...well now yeh affected our economy...our trades..."
- Wags the staff at him *
"Dat me nae like teh see..."
- Foilir walks off chuckling at the diagram wondering if any thought was given to how folks stuck in the tower would get any relief once the fire was set, as the smoke would surely not help their breathing and the fire would keep any supplied and reinforcements...out *
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_After a few days, Dentin returns to see Cyrian, carrying a few crude schematics of the tower and surrounding area. Though most of the schematics are make the tower itself more sturdy, some other designs include what Dentin refers to as the Circle of Fire, apparantly a kind of deep moat filled with oil, that can quickly be lit from the side of the tower to create a temporary yet devestating wall of fire, especially if the goblins are already down in the moat and trying to scale the side up towards the tower. He also shows a simple system to light a warning fire on the top of the tower, which mainly revolves around a quick-burning fuse that runs along the inside of the tower to the bottom, and can easily be lit in case of an emergency.
"These suggestions should offer at least some aid in defending the tower from considerable attacks. Still, I would recommend that Norwick invests in an active and mobile scouting force of the wood to watch the Hobgoblins, and perhaps indeed a signal fire warning system, rather than a tower. Maintaining any kind of permanent fortification this deep in the woods, with a constant goblin presence and no secured line supply line, would require more than a tower and a handful of guards. Why would you allow the constant threat to Norwick to exist at all? The tower would ultimately only provide a warning, and would hardly prove to be a permanent solution. And though there is something to the challenge, it would prove a costly and difficult to undertake, as well as maintain. I would offer my assistance in collapsing any caves the goblins may be using, as well as dealing with those living in the woods."_
