Clearing the Air
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Below is a PM I received and I edited the names of those involved. I have been getting second hand information and rumors. This PM reflects what I have been hearing and I want to make it clear my stand on the issues.
@b752e6851e:
it's sad that the Players of some of XXXâ€
s best friends IC felt they had to leave over it.Basically, I've been around the camp for awhile now… at least 6 months since i signed up on the member thread in April... But I took the oath a little before that. Anyways, the camp had always been kind of a dead place. And the only people I ever saw around were xxx, xxx, xxx, and xxx. thinks hard there may be others, but I can't recall at the moment... So we would spend our time just rp'ing around the camp. Going out to the woods to take care of them, making sure the Gnolls weren't up to anything, sitting around the fire getting drunk off cheap wine... buying combat dummies and archery targets (too expensive btw lol) to beat on and shoot at for a bit of competitive gambling.... Not at the same time though, the drinking and the archery...
So that's about all we had to do, DM attention was always scarce... So once in awhile we'd find a reason to visit other towns. That's why I was really happy to hear about DMs to liven things up a bit. But putting that aside... Even under some of the elders I was feeling unwanted/appreciated.. despite countless hours of rp IG and IC as well as OOC posts on the gypsy threads. Those feelings were brought out all the more when I started to feel unwanted at camp events, and feeling pushed out by players like edited Gaje player name #1 and edited Gaje player name#2 Something I do realize though... Is that if I were a DM... I'd probably do the same thing and invite the people I know to my events. That's why I felt it was pretty important to bring this to your attention... I want to hear about things from your standpoint.
From my standpoint... It made me pretty angry seeing players from other towns taking over the goings on around the camp. Outside of coming down to get birch and showing up for those events... I rarely see those players actually around the camp and rp'ing with us... And this is in no way an attack at them, because I know edited Gaje player name #1 edited, and he rp's him wonderfully... and edited Gaje player name#2 is an excellent RP'er from what I've seen. My only problem is... I never see them rp at the camp outside of the events. Maybe I'm just on at the wrong times but that's always been they way it seemed.
The major event just recently seemed to top it all off... Unfortunately I wasn't there to witness it... But from what I hear. It was started off the same way with the Gaje showing up and fending off some attackers. Ending with the crowning of the king, and him thanking the Gaje and didn't bother to thank the campers or even rp a formal dismissal and thank you for the elders? If that's true... Then it would only prove the things I've been feeling all this time, and I seriously hope that isn't true.
Now, I hope we can all become good friends and make this out to be a win win situation for everybody. We'll have to put up with each other for a while now, after all... I'd really like to hear your thoughts on this so please feel free to hit me back
As I've said before... please consider xxx to be a loyal camper. I've seen how much he works to take care of those spider woods... hehe... and he rarely leaves the camp, so he has nothing else to do really but help.I realize that change is uncomfortable. I understand that many have different views on how I should run things in the camp. As I have stated before, I do not run events only for campers. My events start in the camp but often spread outward. I am the SDM of the camp but a DM of Narfell.
From my perspective, why would I turn away someone who doesnâ€
t complain, doesnâ€t grief me, isnâ€t jealous of others, isnâ€t petty, compliments me on my events afterwards and WANTS to be a part of my event? Iâ€m supposed to have fun with this game too!Just as you are allowed to participate in other DMs events, the “Gaje†are permitted to come in the camp and participate in my events.
If you feel uncomfortable with any “Gaje†that I have in my event, then you donâ€
t have to participate. Find another DM and participate in his/her event.During the event on Friday, there were Campers present. I did not get a chance to have a group meeting with the elders because many left right a way or laughed at my King IC.
I know that there is a lot of talking about me and this is the first player to contact me directly and I am thankful for that.
I feel I must clear the air about other issues too. I follow the rules of the game correctly and should anyone have a problem with me or feel I am “twinking†people or giving special favors, they should talk to me directly instead of spreading false rumors. I am greatly offended that people talk behind my back spreading false tales and accusing me of not treating everyone fairly.
Understand one thing. If you donâ€
t like what I have done or will do to the camp, you can leave. I do not get paid for this. My RL is stressful enough and I donâ€t need the stress of being accused of things that I do not do or being told that I can or cannot have certain players in my events.I am hoping that the camp can be a welcoming place for all and not so territorial.
What I posted before:
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This doesn't seem to be getting anywhere.
The Gypsy Camp will be run by an SDM now. While some may not like this, it has been done for many reasons, including the requests of the very Camp members that are biting the hand that feeds them, among other OOC reasons.
What is unbelievable is that people are whining that they'll be receiving more DM attention, but it's not how they expected it. That is what it comes down to.
Shit like this is why DMs quit.
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Ok this post is from viewing the stats alone. There comes a time when maybe the dm's have to sway to the player base, and maybe adapt to what they want. 5 players have left directly or indirectly because of what happend, that may not seem like many. but in the camp that is a bloody lot, that is 11% of the gypsy camp, 11% is a big number, and that is taking in to account inactive members and mebers that are no longer there but are still members, take them out and your looking at closer to 25%, when a large number like that is unhappy, maybe they should be listened to. Just an idea…......
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Edited: due to the fact I cannot be bothered wasting my time. Assume what you will. They are yours to keep.
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It's a pretty cheap tactic to take a single fragment of what someone says and quote them on it. Perhaps you should also remember how to speak in a civil manner to a DM.
What River is saying is what all the Narfell DMs have been saying for a long, long time now. If you don't like what's going on in your town/camp/city/village, try somewhere else. If you don't like what's going on in Narfell, then maybe you should try another server. DMs do not cater to players. We are here to provide entertainment and challenges to a wide variety of players, not to a select few, no matter how much they may whine, bitch and/or moan.
Most people enjoy what Narfell has to offer and what the DMs bring to the server. Some people won't. You cannot attempt to please everyone and I know I'm not going to try.
There are people who have left that I have been very, very happy to see them go. There are people that I will not miss when they finally leave. However, most of the people in Narfell, I do enjoy and consider positive members of the community.
Why don't you read River's post again. She isn't saying leave. She's saying she wants to get beyond what's happened so far. What she is saying is that if you don't like how she's running things (hopefully after you actually give them a chance) then you can leave, because a few voices, no matter how loud they get won't change her direction, to which I agree. ie. If you don't like intrigue, politics, and long drawn out plots, don't come to Peltarch, because that is how that location is run by me. You want large scale town attacks on a regular basis? Try somewhere else.
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@50157b458a=Riverthorn:
Understand one thing. If you donâ€
t like what I have done or will do to the camp, you can leave.I really enjoy how you dismiss us all off in short as a sentence. Oh no, wait whats this?
@50157b458a=Riverthorn:
The fact of the matter is, that it's over with. It's done. Let's move on. Let's try to have a postive future.
Is it me or is someone feeling guilt? I love narfell, I love the players who shone on me what roleplaying is. But some people make you want to stay, and some people make you want to leave.
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If you noticed I did not play much the week of the big event River had set up, but I made it a point to log on and to be there to see the changes going down. Changes are needed and the Elderâ€
s being dissolved has my 100% nod of approval. We did really nothing the last year or so, most of the Elders were on and off with their activity. So a King run by River was a great move in my opinion.I have gotten PMs saying “I canâ€
t believe you left Narf over losing your Elder positionâ€. Please donâ€t assume you know whatâ€s going on with me or what Iâ€m working towards. The DM team knows my reasoning and my woes and losing an Elder position that was redundant and had little use was not it.As for Elders laughing at the King, I did not witness this at all, but then again I cannot be everywhere all at once. I know that IG Cotton told Chandon to shut his mouth and show respect. So I do not know what Elder is being referred to in the above accusation.
At this point I just need time to back away and look things over, yes I am unhappy with some things I see in Narfell, but does that mean I do not love it still? Absolutely not, my year+ of ridiculous hours invested should show any on the server my dedication to it.
But like Kerby, RW, and many others sometimes leaving for a while or venting is needed. I hope the problems in camp will be fixed, not only for the players but the DMs as well. Seems many are unhappy and ignoring it or telling people to pack up and leave is not the answer.
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@71e11a32b0=Riverthorn:
It's obvious we have a disagreement and are seeing things from different perspectives.
The fact of the matter is, that it's over with. It's done. Let's move on. Let's try to have a postive future.
I think an issue like this is a bit hard to just build a bridge and get over, contact me in IRC, and I'll fully explain to you in private how the players felt as the public forums is not the best place to do it. I think if this issue is fixed up the future for the camp may be even better.
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@d09452c395=Baboo:
The elders did try to talk to Horgan as far as I have been told, but Horgan preferred talking to two Gaje (I'm refraining from mentioning char names here). Now who am I to believe? two different stories are being told, on one side your saying one thing River but on the otherside the players are saying something different?
It's obvious we have a disagreement and are seeing things from different perspectives.
The fact of the matter is, that it's over with. It's done. Let's move on. Let's try to have a postive future.
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The elders did try to talk to Horgan as far as I have been told, but Horgan preferred talking to two Gaje (I'm refraining from mentioning char names here). Now who am I to believe? two different stories are being told, on one side your saying one thing River but on the otherside the players are saying something different?
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@17eb42e9b5=Baboo:
The elders I am told were dismissed with no IG RP, maybe an accident once again, but it made the players feel shafted.
There is nothing wrong with change at the camp, but I think some players just had a problem with the manner in which it occured.
@17eb42e9b5=Riverthorn:
During the event on Friday, there were Campers present. I did not get a chance to have a group meeting with the elders because many left right a way or laughed at my King IC.
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ok lemme clear somethings up as well. I think Gobble you and River have both misunderstood what the players meant. The players you are referring to had no problems about, outsiders being in camp events. The problem they felt was that during the said events the gaje were given preference rather then the gali or not even treated equally, so in a manner of speaking teh yfelt teh events were hijacked by outsiders.
The elders did not laugh at the king IC, but felt shafted by him IC and OOC, that may have been accidental, but it's how they felt. At one point I am told, that The king gave a gaje a helm which the gaje then immediately tried to sell to a camper for 2000 gold, they did not see this as being fair.
The elders I am told were dismissed with no IG RP, maybe an accident once again, but it made the players feel shafted.
There is nothing wrong with change at the camp, but I think some players just had a problem with the manner in which it occured.
THIS POST CONTAINS MY OPINION PARTUALY AND IS JUST HERE TO SHOW THE OTHERSIDE OF THE COIN, IT IS NOT A FLAME SO DO NOT TAKE IT AS ONE
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Great post River. Here are some of my thoughts…....
People need to realize that just because you are a member of the Camp does not give you the exclusive rights to events there. If you want that special treatment and special events just for you then join a guild. Guilds are for special events and special treatment.
Events are open to all on the server ((lag preventing size for some as well as IC reasons)) and that is especially true when you have such a global plot like River has been doing. It is not geared toward any particular person or group, but it is an environment changing event.
Not once did anyone ever bitch when the well went crazy in Norwick and a trip had to be taken into the underdark. Oh and you know what. Those events DID include Campers, Jiyydians, as well as many others. The gypsy camp is no different from Norwick, Jiyyd and Peltarch and events that go on there is not exclusive to just the ones who have membership. Everyone has participated in a Norwick invasion or a bandit attack at some point I'm sure.
Most should be thankful you have a SDM like Riverthorn who will run events for the camp period. She has taken it on her shoulders to create ongoing plots, interesting stories, as well as making an effort to improve not only the camp, but the server as well. Instead of having hard feelings everyone should thank her for taking the time to breathe life back into the camp.
THIS IS JUST MY OPINION AS A PLAYER AND DOES NOT REFLECT ANYONE OTHER THAN MY VIEWS ESPECIALLY NOT THE DMS! River delete it if you want.
No DMs were harmed in the creation of this post.
