3. What is Luck?

What is Luck?


  • Alright I know it seems like a strange question for my to propose to you lot however I encourage you to give this a read and even more so an opinion.

    I have been a part of a small circle of people at my university who get together every weekend and discuss one random topic for fun, debating sometimes arguing the others of course. With that in mind this is where I got this question that divided me and my friends individually for the first time in all our talks we have never had a topic that divided us as individuals instead of groups. When my friend brought up the topic many of us sat and thought and contemplated because we didn't really have a definition for what luck really was other then 'luck'.

    dictionary definition of luck - http://www.thefreedictionary.com/luck

    Many of us found this definition to the point that is started a 5 hour argument that never did end with many agreeing on one thing.

    I will spare off my own thoughts for now, I would really like to know what you all think. Perhaps me and my group of friends are just strange that is another whole topic in itself however 😛


  • That's closer to the mark than most.

    It's a human construction.


  • Luck is what you make it.


  • @bb69b310b4=Clan:

    @bb69b310b4:

    Everything that exists has a physical or chemical reason. Luck doesn't.
    Because if luck had a physical or chemical reason, then it'd stop being luck, it'd be something else as it could be manipulated by scientist.

    So… Does that mean that religion doesn't exist either? How about "hope?" "Love?" "Hate?".

    'Religion' can be translated as 'Reunion' from latin word 'Religare'.

    Many things exists in world of ideas, but not in physical world. Still they do affect physical world just by affecting how we think. Perhaps more.

    Nuomen is word describing something insubstantial, intangible, that cannot be perceived. Such things do not exist. (for example 'Nuomenal World of Imagination'). Nuomen does not exist by definition, but this word can be used to describe things as such.

    Phenomen can be physical or perceived.


  • Luck is anything that interjects between yourself and calamity. Just as 'bad luck' is the lack thereof. As a for instance, I dropped my wallet exiting a car a few days ago. I hadn't noticed. I took my rottweiler out for a walk when I noticed, in the dark, my wallet lying beside the car where it had presumably lain for hours without being noticed by neighbors or passers by – which, to me, was very lucky.

    Perhaps 'luck' is absent. Just as much as 'God' is absent. Or just as much as 'aliens' are absent. Or the 'Loch Ness Monster' is absent...

    I'm not ready to rule cosmic nudges out of the way just yet personally. A little luck every now and then, nomatter how subtle, is better than no luck at all.


  • Now given that I read all the posts it is amazing how similar this talk is.

    Here are the big two of my talk with my friends;
    -Luck does not exist, it is like religion or myths, it exists to hide our ignorance and lack of knowledge.
    -Luck is something we create through choice. We choose our own path at any number or forks and create luck if we have chosen correctly. We chose to choose

    (I dont mean any offence to any religious and im sorry for any spelling my phone has bad auto correct and im retarded)

  • G

    Perhaps. But if it has a chemical or physical reason, then it's not luck anymore. As luck per definition scapes all of the wordly rules.

    I think we Narfers are a bunch of hidden philosophers…


  • @6f9febe337=Gonnar:

    @6f9febe337=Clan:

    @6f9febe337:

    Everything that exists has a physical or chemical reason. Luck doesn't.
    Because if luck had a physical or chemical reason, then it'd stop being luck, it'd be something else as it could be manipulated by scientist.

    So… Does that mean that religion doesn't exist either? How about "hope?" "Love?" "Hate?"

    Matter of factly, all these feelings you are naming here have their own chemical reactions inside of our bodies. It's been studied already.
    For example, Love, as that feeling where you feel butterflies and blablabla… only lasts from 4 to 10 months. During this time your body segregates this hormones and that hormones, and it's what causes you to feel like it.

    So maybe feeling "lucky" also exhibits a chemical reaction as well.

  • Legion

    @dd876e7388=Emerwyn:

    "We've had a lucky year, what a blessing from the gods" said the Greek farmer - "it rained abundantly and steadily, so my family won't suffer of hunger in a long time". But just a few miles away a professor and philosopher had published the meteorological charts that explained why and when rains happen, and it really had nothing to do with luck or divine gifts from the gods….

    I would imagine that the Greek Farmer would argue that the professor or philosopher being able to predict the weather in no way negates his gratitude for his situation. The professor and the philosopher may see the farmer's gratitude as being based on ignorance, and that may well be the case. But it could also be that the farmer would say the same thing of them, that all their charts and predictions had left them spiritually ignorant, ungrateful and shallow heated. Knowing how or when the "luck" or "divine gift" comes would in now way negate it's significance for the farmer.

    If the farmers concept of "luck" or "divine blessing" only exists in an attempt to explain things he doesn't understand, then the knowledge of the philosopher and the professor would shrink his faith a bit. But I always though that it was interesting that even though the ancient Hebrews understood how the water table worked, they'd still say that "God sends rain". Not all "spirituality" is based on ignorance. Often it's a response to reality.

    Best quote ever:

    @dd876e7388=Albert:

    “There are two ways to live: You can live as if nothing is a miracle; or, you can live as if everything is a miracle.”

  • G

    @e219ee7c88=Clan:

    @e219ee7c88:

    Everything that exists has a physical or chemical reason. Luck doesn't.
    Because if luck had a physical or chemical reason, then it'd stop being luck, it'd be something else as it could be manipulated by scientist.

    So… Does that mean that religion doesn't exist either? How about "hope?" "Love?" "Hate?"

    Matter of factly, all these feelings you are naming here have their own chemical reactions inside of our bodies. It's been studied already.
    For example, Love, as that feeling where you feel butterflies and blablabla… only lasts from 4 to 10 months. During this time your body segregates this hormones and that hormones, and it's what causes you to feel like it.


  • @c10a14a458:

    Everything that exists has a physical or chemical reason. Luck doesn't.
    Because if luck had a physical or chemical reason, then it'd stop being luck, it'd be something else as it could be manipulated by scientist.

    So… Does that mean that religion doesn't exist either? How about "hope?" "Love?" "Hate?"

    I am not very religious. I tend to think that most religions, or at least their scripture, was created because man did not have the tools nor knowledge to otherwise explain things like science, evolution, etc.

    I think "luck" is similar. Being lucky was a way to describe someone's good fortune that could not otherwise be attributed to reason (or religion I suppose) . My grandfather (x3) was shot in the civil war. The bullet hit his bible, which he kept in his left breast pocket and saved his life.

    Was that luck? (My family calls it that). Was it just a very opportune coincidence? Or did he and his Union buddies all keep their thickest book there for just this reason?

    I like to believe in luck. When I buy lottery tickets, I claim no skill other than handing over some cash. I do not pray to anyone for winning numbers. I hope I am lucky enough to win.


  • Slightly related, I can tell you a tale that an old History teacher told me.

    The story took place in the 16th century, when a Spanish explorer was captured by a Mayan tribe. He was going to be sacrificed but he thought "How fortunate of me that today there is a sun eclipse. Bless civilization and our advances, that thanks to them I know this will happen today, and I'll be able to trick these illiterate brutes into freeing me".

    When the time came, he was put in the sacrificial table, but the explorer then played his card: as he had studied the Mayan language, he threatened the Mayan people "I am a powerful herald of the gods. If you do not free me, I will curse you with disease and famine. I will rain pestilence, and I will darken the sky!" as he pointed out at the sun, the eclipse was about to begin.

    To this, the Mayan shaman simply reached for a scroll and began to read all the sun eclipses that his people had predicted during the next 500 years, just while the explorer was sacrificed to the gods.

    This is to say, that luck can have many definitions. When we don't know the pattern that eclipses follow, we can think it's lucky that there was an eclipse. Truth is, it just happened because it was its turn to happen as consequence of many established and explainable factors, of which we may or may not have knowledge. "We've had a lucky year, what a blessing from the gods" said the Greek farmer - "it rained abundantly and steadily, so my family won't suffer of hunger in a long time". But just a few miles away a professor and philosopher had published the meteorological charts that explained why and when rains happen, and it really had nothing to do with luck or divine gifts from the gods.

    In that light, what we call "luck" is product of ignorance, or lack of interest in learning why and when some things happen because of being too complex for us to bother with or even understand. This is especially emphasized when our actions return extremely rewarding or disastrous outcomes that were not excessively expected. Then we are simply satisfied with giving the merit to "luck", or lack of it. I think that definition can apply to about every scenario where we claim that luck is involved.


  • @b2b6a3dc84=cardamon:

    MCPlay: -5 points. What's 50 plus 50 plus 40?

    An internet joke 🙂 http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/events/2011-russian-protests

  • Legion

    I'm not sure if the numerical predictability of a certain outcome negates the concept of luck.

    If seemingly random (but predictable it you know everything and crunch the numbers) events turn out in your favor so that you would be considered fortunate then by definition you have experienced "good luck".

    If events turn out against you and you are unfortunate, then by definition you have been unlucky.

    There is a tendency for some to spiritualise things they don't fully understand. So if someone sees a pattern of good fortune or misfortune they may attribute a supernatural cause to it if they don't see the full "mathematical" picture. That's not to say that the spiritual or the supernatural isn't real. But we can't give birth to spiritual concepts from our lack of understanding. Good spirituality comes from revelation and thought. Not by wondering why things are and making up an answer that feels good for us.
    @6fd56eec70=Emerwyn:

    Everything is consequence of something else.

    I reckon that's spot on. Whether or not the supernatural can be counted among the "something else"s is the question that usually polarizes people.


  • I'm a mathematician and a computer scientist (and in a few months, that'll actually be true on paper). I don't believe in luck. However I know of numerical bias, data clusters, PRNGs with large entropy, and random number generators having some predictability with given seeds, therefore being more semi than truly random.

    In short, there is no such thing as an absolutely fair die.

    MCPlay: -5 points. What's 50 plus 50 plus 40?


  • @81adee7a26=Kayleb:

    Luck is rolling a 20, or at least high enough to beat the DC.

    this.

    Seriously though, IMHO, luck is that good thing you're not sure will happen, but then it does. One thing is the statistical, mathematical probability that X will happen 50% of the time, Y another 50% (and Z the remaining 40%), a whole different game is an individual expecting one of those outcomes, and getting exactly what they wanted. That, in my point of view is what luck is all about. From the several possible outcomes, the one you want is the one you get. If there's a Divine hand guiding the odds in your favor, that's a whole different thing, I think, but from the point of view of us mortals down here, that's pretty much it…


  • Most of the time luck is there just so we as humans have something to blame when things don't go our way, because it is not our nature to admit that we may have done something wrong. Most of the time we're unlucky, or life has been unfair.

    But I agree with Gonnar, Luck as a magical, divine and unpredictable godly hand that points at random people to reward them out of the dark beyond doesn't exist. Everything is consequence of something else.

    If you have watched the Mentalist, you probably have seen the chapter where they explain that it is possible to create an algorithm to know what number will win lottery, if all paramenters are known: initial ball position before they start spinning, every ball's exact weight and composition, exact magnitude of all forces that act on them (gravity, centrifuge..) etc.

    I guess you could call it luck when you win lottery without knowing all of that or bothering to calculate the outcome of all that cumulation of actions and reactions, but the number that came out was still fully predictable from a scientific point of view.

  • G

    Luck can't exist as such, because there's nothing that causes it.

    Everything that exists has a physical or chemical reason. Luck doesn't.
    Because if luck had a physical or chemical reason, then it'd stop being luck, it'd be something else as it could be manipulated by scientist.

    Diadne is not a person, it's a character of a game, and as such nothing of the RL world applies to it. You could argue then, you are the lucky one when you play Diadne. But fact is, is just maths:

    If there's 1/1000000 chances something can happen. IT MUST HAPPEN at some point. And Diadne was that point.


  • @b83fbfe354=Gonnar:

    In my opinion:

    Luck doesn't exist as such.

    Luck is attitude.

    I'm going to disagree. While there are people whose attitude and general skill at optimizing situations may make them appear luckier than others, there are folks (or characters) that good things just happen to. They are simply luckier than others. Diadne is a good example.

  • G

    In my opinion:

    Luck doesn't exist as such.

    Luck is attitude.